- Konstantin Olegovich, first of all, I would like to clarify the key question: who are compatriots? It is known, for example, that the law on state policy regarding compatriots calls all natives of the former USSR compatriots. Do you proceed from this, the broadest possible interpretation, or some other one?
- By compatriots we mean those who speak Russian, are raised in the traditions of Russian culture, and are ready to take part in the state program on its terms. They must be close to us in spirit, share our values. And, of course, we don't need those with, excuse the expression, three convictions behind them - we expect people who will respect our laws. And lastly: people coming to us must have qualifications; we are interested not in ditch diggers, but in high-class specialists.
- Are these criteria clear enough to avoid complaints or conflicts about the legitimacy of selection? Why, they say, was one taken and another rejected?
- You can't foresee all options; everything will be decided individually on a case-by-case basis. We will undoubtedly encounter situations where a person is Kyrgyz or Tajik by nationality but has become so Russified that it would be a sin not to call him a compatriot. A special unit is being created in the central office of the service that will deal only with program issues. We will check and adjust the decisions of our primary structures - territorial divisions and FMS offices abroad.
- And are disabled compatriots welcome? Can, for example, elderly people who once went to socialist construction projects count on participating in the program?
- We welcome everyone, but it must be understood that within the state program we are also solving economic problems. One of the tasks of the FMS is to help "feed" regions in need of labor with qualified resources. Family members can come with the migrant, and they also receive all state guarantees. Family means husband, wife, and children. However, once a person settles down, they will naturally have the opportunity to bring their elderly parents.
- According to you, in 2007 it is planned to attract about 50,000 compatriots to Russia, in 2008 - 100,000, in 2009 - 150,000. What determined these limits?
- These figures are only preliminary guidelines. We are not chasing mass numbers. At the first stage, 12 pilot regions are participating in the program: first we need to work out the mechanism - so that there are no failures, so that people can adapt to the new place.
- But what if the number of those willing to relocate turns out to be larger than planned?
- I wouldn't want to make far-reaching predictions. We'll live and see. There is still too much unknown for us: how many compatriots will want to relocate, how they will settle in the new place, what the needs and capabilities of the territories will be. If 80 regions join the program, the numbers will be different.
- Will migrants be able to choose Moscow, St. Petersburg, Krasnodar Krai, or other "cozy spots" as their place of residence?
- In the pilot version, these regions are not included. But if they show interest in migrants, we will, of course, provide such an opportunity.
- How long will program participants have to wait for full Russian citizenship?
- The citizenship issue will be resolved on a priority basis; it will take no more than 6 months from the time of relocation.
- How expensive will these guests be? What is the cost of the program?
- No one can give you the final figure today. Everything will depend on the number of migrants, the cost of living in the region, its remoteness - the program provides not only "relocation allowances" but also compensation for transportation expenses. According to our estimates, costs next year will amount to 4-5 billion rubles. But all invested funds will pay off; we are counting on a long-term effect.
- Perhaps the most important issue is housing. In the program, its solution is entirely assigned to the regions. Where will decent housing for migrants come from in not-too-rich "bear corners" where the migration flow is primarily expected to be directed? After all, even locals often lack square meters.
- One of the principles of the program is the balance of interests of migrants, the state, and business. Since labor resources are needed by entrepreneurs, they should not stay away from the housing issue either. It's difficult to say what the housing will be like yet, but of course certain standards must be met. The FMS will very carefully assess the readiness of the region. We are the ones inviting migrants, and we will have to blush in front of them if they are met with a canvas tent or a dilapidated barracks. Of course, we will not allow it to be said that these people are not living but surviving. But neither will I claim that it will be a "paradise in the apple trees." I think that would simply be dishonest.
- By the way, according to the program, FMS offices that will be engaged in "recruiting" migrants will open not only in the former republics of the Union but also in Germany, the USA, and Israel. Frankly, today this looks like a utopia. Will people really go from prosperous Europe and America - about war-torn Israel, the conversation is special, but even there the standard of living is higher - to the Russian hinterland?
- It must be taken into account that not all of our former compatriots have found themselves there. Even if you are in extremely favorable conditions, you'll howl like a wolf without work. Remember that even in the difficult thirties, specialists came to the USSR from the unemployment-ridden USA and Germany. It is very important for a person to feel in demand.
- Does the program solve the problems of those compatriots who have already moved to Russia but are still living on borrowed time? There are many known cases where Russians who left the former Soviet republics are recognized as illegal migrants or even sent back.
- The program is designed for those living abroad today. Yes, compatriots who have moved to Russia from the former USSR republics have many problems today. Some of them fled interethnic conflicts, losing all documents. And we are ready to help them. But they also need to meet us halfway. Running and hiding, constantly bribing some officials, is not the way out; let's solve the problem together. And besides, don't forget that from January 15 of next year, the law on migration registration of foreign citizens and the amendment to the law on the legal status of foreigners come into force, which significantly simplify migrants' lives.
- So two parallel flows are forming? Some relocate with state support, others at their own risk.
- No, one flow is already here - those people who came to Russia and work. But they work mostly illegally. In the country, according to our estimates, there are about 10 million illegal labor migrants, only 10-15% of foreign workers have formalized their status. The adopted laws solve many problems, but I believe we need to give additional preferences to these people. I don't really like the word "amnesty," but apparently some special act will be needed that would allow them to legalize.
- Helping compatriots is a holy cause. But the need for guest workers, according to your opponents, is greatly exaggerated. Indeed: Russia today has over 90 million citizens of working age - more than the RSFSR in 1991. The economy has shrunk since then, and the country has over 5 million unemployed. Where does this need for "imported" labor come from?
- No matter how you and I count, millions of guest workers came to our country not on a whim: supply arises when there is demand. We have territories that are almost completely depopulated - industrial enterprises are shutting down, agriculture is in decline. A garden city will not grow in an empty, dead place. Who will build it? There is no one. That's why we are forced to attract migrants.
- Recently I came across a speech by a Latvian government demographer. Demographics there also have problems, nevertheless the expert confidently states that Latvia does not need guest workers: the idea of attracting migrants is promoted by entrepreneurs seeking to increase profits through cheap labor. What do you say?
- This problem exists here too: dishonest employers bring in low-paid illegals. We need to fight this, and the Duma is already working on a bill that provides for increased employer liability for each illegal labor migrant. Moreover, although the new laws are extremely humane, do not think they will make the situation uncontrollable. All parameters are clearly spelled out. Please - we give our guests the opportunity to work legally. But if they break the law, they will be spoken to in the language of the Administrative and Criminal Codes.
- But another requirement suggests itself - before hiring migrants, even legal ones, employers must exhaust all possibilities to attract local residents. It's no secret that foreign workers seriously undercut the labor market.
- I agree. But let's still focus on those issues that fall under the competence of the Federal Migration Service.
- Then a question for your part. How to explain this paradox: migrants will now have more freedom in choosing their place of residence than citizens of the country? It is still difficult for a person with a Russian passport to register in another city, while from January 15, migrant registration will be of a notification nature, and they will be able to live anywhere, even in non-residential premises.
- Yes, there are points that need to be brought to uniformity. The inconsistencies are caused primarily by the speed of adoption of migration laws. A corresponding analysis is already underway, these norms will definitely be clarified and supplemented.
- Konstantin Olegovich, migrants today make up about 10% of the total population. And society often expresses concerns that further influx will lead to increased social and interethnic tensions, to the emergence of a new Kosovo somewhere in our vastness.
- No, no, Kosovo will not happen. And there is no tension at all. Who comes to us? Mostly residents of CIS countries, former USSR citizens, that is, people very close to us in spirit. Moreover, they come here not to relax but to work, and therefore they are not interested in excesses like those that recently happened in France. At the same time, of course, we must set up barriers to criminal groups.
- And yet, Russia's migration capacity probably has its limits. Are we not at risk of crossing the line beyond which we will get a completely different country?
- I am convinced that as long as we accept people from the former Soviet republics, this will not happen. In migration issues, we are about twenty years behind Western countries, but there is a certain advantage in this. We see the mistakes they made and will try not to step on the same rake.