- Tatyana Vladimirovna, tell us, how did the idea of creating the association come about?
- The idea of creating such an association had been brewing for a long time. Throughout the world, there is such a concept as labor migration, and there are certain legislative documents regulating it. And only in the post-Soviet space is this process chaotic. To put it bluntly, even now there are firms that send people to work abroad on tourist visas or with other violations of the law. Frankly fraudulent firms also undermine the reputation of international employment agencies. These are sore issues not only for Ukraine. That is why in February 2003, the All-Russian Association of International Recruitment Agencies was created in Russia.
At first, a conference was held, to which representatives of various organizations and agencies whose activities are in one way or another connected with overseas employment were invited. Among the conference participants were representatives of the International Labour Organization, the International Labour Office, the International Organization for Migration, the FSB and the FMS (Federal Migration Service). Recruitment agencies from all regions of Russia also responded actively. Among the conference participants were employees of crewing companies, art show companies, companies specializing in the employment of medical workers, transport workers, agricultural workers, and many others. Among the guests were representatives of Ukraine, Belarus, and Moldova. It should be noted that Russians took the issue of regulating the process of international employment very seriously.
- Sometimes we can encounter a sharply negative attitude towards going abroad to earn money...
- I consider such an attitude to be fundamentally wrong. At the conference, representatives of the Ministry of Statistics of the Russian Federation spoke. They cited the following facts: out of a hundred people who worked for a couple of years abroad, upon returning, 90 found employment in Russia (found a job or started their own business), and only 10 people after some time went abroad again. That is, there is no 'catastrophic' outflow of labor abroad - people earn money, return, and invest it in their country's economy.
The same situation is now developing in Ukraine. By the way, a typical example is our western region. If a year ago a house in Ternopil cost $10-15 thousand, now it costs $20-25 thousand. The sharp rise in real estate prices is explained by the influx of money earned abroad. So we need not to stop the process of labor migration, but to regulate it, develop a legislative and methodological base, and organize advisory services. That is how we come to the need to unite professionals in this field of activity.
- And what are the tasks of the association?
- As I have already said, it is, first of all, a union of professionals. Currently, about five hundred agencies in Ukraine have licenses for employment abroad. And if Kyiv companies have access to new information, regional firms are often deprived of such an opportunity. Many work simply by trial and error, sometimes due to lack of information and experience they make gross errors in their work. There is also no proper interest in such agencies on the part of national government structures and consular services.
Creating an association will make it possible to lobby the interests of agencies involved in international employment at any level. For example, if some embassies are wary or even dismissive of requests from employees of these firms, then inquiries made on behalf of the association receive answers immediately. The association will provide an opportunity to freely exchange accumulated experience and jointly develop uniform ethical standards of work. Finally, it will serve as a kind of filter, weeding out unscrupulous firms. But, I repeat, the main task is consultative and methodological support.
- What problems are the most relevant for international employment agencies?
- Well, firstly, it is the issue of establishing business partnerships with foreign employers. Our agencies are still treated with considerable wariness. At the same time, employees of these agencies have a very vague idea of what an international contract is, how it is concluded, with whom, what clauses it should contain, and so on.
Secondly, very soon questions of taxation, work experience, and pension accrual will begin to arise. To be honest, many of our citizens go to work abroad illegally. But now the flow of illegal workers is decreasing, and many are interested in legal work. People ask: “To whom and where are taxes paid? We are ready to work legally, help us!” Or, for example, the problem of insurance - who should insure the worker? According to international rules, the employer is obliged to do this, but, in particular, quite recently problems arose with insuring workers in Israel. Who and how should resolve such issues is also still unclear.
Legal aspects of Ukrainian and international legislation regulating the process of international labor exchange are a pressing issue. In the near future, we will be interested not only in the export but also in the import of labor. It would be very good if our scientists – lawyers, economists – seriously took up these issues. This is a matter of political significance. Unfortunately, at present no one can advise representatives of agencies regarding the specifics of labor legislation in different countries. There are a number of publications on this topic, but systematic consultation does not yet exist. The task of the association is to organize this process so that every member, upon application, can get an answer to their question.
There are also a number of specific difficulties. For example, how can an agency insure itself against 'non-returners'? A person goes abroad seemingly for work, and then, on the spot, goes into an illegal situation. Of course, this immediately casts a shadow not only on the firm that sent him, but also on all others working in that country. At the Russian conference, a fairly effective mechanism for insuring against such cases was proposed. We are currently working on a mechanism through which the Association will act as a guarantee for the return of workers. If it works, the confidence of embassies will increase, and all agencies will feel it.
Finally, the issue of training personnel for agencies engaged in foreign employment is also important. These specialists must have appropriate legal and psychological training. After all, our clients are a very complex contingent. Many are confused, have fallen into depression, and seize on going abroad as a lifeline. If I, for example, see that a person's problems are internal, I categorically dissuade him from leaving. The fact is that a person will carry his own 'problem hump' with him. 'Help me sell a kidney abroad! Send me to work abroad with someone else's passport! I'll go in the hold, in the trunk, etc.' Believe me, this is all not serious. And thinking that you can only earn money 'there' is not worth it. Even if your neighbor brought back a 'pile of money' from abroad, that does not mean you will earn the same there. So each client is an individual complex conversation. And it should be conducted by a professional. In Russia, for example, there is a special institute where such specialists are trained.
- What does their training program include?
- In 2000, in agreement with the Ministry of Education of the Russian Federation, the Institute for Migration Process Management was established at the State University of Management. The Institute established business partnerships with the Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees. Currently, students study a number of specialized disciplines: migration legislation and human rights protection, organization of work with migrants abroad, legislative foundations of labor migration, internal migration, etc.
- Are there any legislative requirements for the activities of international employment agencies?
- Of course. They are set out in the licensing conditions. Currently they are being revised, and a number of additional requirements are to be introduced. In particular, the head of an agency must have a higher legal education. The office must be equipped with a fax, e-mail, and must have its own website on the Internet. Otherwise, it is almost impossible to maintain prompt communication with a foreign partner. Unfortunately, in Ukraine few agencies are equipped in this way.
- What are the association's immediate plans?
- Currently, the association is at the stage of formation. We are accumulating methodological material, establishing productive ties with state structures, and planning further development. The immediate goal of the 'Partnerstvo' association is to hold an all-Ukrainian conference of international employment agencies. We tentatively plan to hold it at the end of the year. I believe that now we simply need to meet, exchange accumulated experience, and develop a unified strategy for further development. Experience is something that cannot be read in any document; it is something that a person has lived through, suffered through, and shares with you. As a rule, international employment agencies do not compete with each other - we all work in different regions. Therefore, we can freely and productively cooperate. Our main goal is advisory and information support for association members, raising our work to a qualitatively new level. We work with people and for people - that is why it is so important for us to learn to speak with foreign partners as equals. And this will become possible only through joint efforts.